Why do bad things happen to good people?

[mike435]

This is actually a very simple question. The answer is this: Bad people are good at making bad systems that benefit them most.

What's interesting enough is that for the first time good people have not only realized this but have the opportunity to fight and make the global and locals systems in a way that benefits everyone justly.

but how do you decide who is "good" and who is "bad"

is bad the side that you want to be on but you are not

so once the good fight the bad than do the good people become bad because noe they are controling the system that is defying theme

also what is there that says who ever gains the position of good in the system wouldnt indukge in it

[maryam9]

4. moses book 16, 31-35

4. moses book 16, 45-50

4. moses book 14, 18 (i have a persian translation!: it says that yahova is this and that and in the end of verse it says that sins of fathers will be used against their sons until 3rd and 4th generation!)

It seems in Torah and other holy books God loves killing! even in christian bible! it is more like a action book instead of a holy book!

God i know and believe in is almighty and one! but i will never understand the way he is doing thing in!

1. what do u mean?
2 - thats true, we cannot understand our Creator.

[mike435]

.1where are you?our suffering can bring benefit to you and to the world.


Let us not try and find the meaning of suffering, but rather make suffering meaningful.

http://www.askmoses.com/article.html?h=552&o=395813

if you click on the link you can read comments and arguments other have wrote

[maryam9]

I came across this and thought it was interesting/thought-provoking.
(All quotes are from the Bahai holy writings)


THE MEANING OF SUFFERING

"I swear by My life! Nothing save that which profiteth them can befall my loved ones. To this testifieth the Pen of God, the Most Powerful, the All-Glorious, the Best-Beloved."

Why do we Suffer?Suffering Develops the Soul

"Grief and sorrow do not come to us by chance, they are sent by the Divine Mercy for our own perfecting."

"Everything in life ministers to our development. Our lesson is to study and learn... Tests are either stumbling-blocks or stepping-stones, just as we make them."

"Anybody can be happy in the state of comfort, ease, health, success, pleasure and joy; but if one be happy and contented in the time of trouble, hardship and prevailing disease, it is the proof of nobility."

"Men who suffer not, attain no perfection. The plant most pruned by the gardeners is that one which, when the summer comes, will have the most beautiful blossoms and the most abundant fruit."

"Those who suffer most, attain to the greatest perfection..."

The Purpose of LifeInnocent Children

"As to the subject of babes and infants...who are afflicted...for those souls there is a recompense in another world...For those souls that suffering is the greatest mercy of God."

Patience and AcceptanceLive in the Spiritual WorldThe Example of the Messengers of GodThe Desire for Suffering

If we really understand the purpose of our suffering in this life and how to use it, we will reach the stage where we long for tests in order to show our love for God and to draw closer to Him:

"The true lover yearneth for tribulation even as doth the rebel for forgiveness and the sinful for mercy."

"O Son of Man! If adversity befall thee not in My path, how canst thou walk in the ways of them that are content with My pleasure? If trials afflict thee not in thy longing to meet Me, how wilt thou attain the light in thy love for My beauty?"

"O Son of Man! My calamity is My providence, outwardly it is fire and vengeance, but inwardly it is light and mercy. Hasten thereunto that thou mayest become an eternal light and an immortal spirit."

[indian_blues]

ok, but what about someone who is born with an incurable disease?

difficult question...

they inherit their parents bad karma.

What is good and bad? I say there is nothing good or bad exists.

[maryam9]

ok, but what about someone who is born with an incurable disease?

difficult question...

they inherit their parents bad karma.

What is good and bad? I say there is nothing good or bad exists.

is this a hindu belief?
so are u saying that hindus believe that the outcome of a child's life is dependent upon the previous actions of the the parents (which therefore influence parents' karma)

[sooz]

they inherit their parents bad karma.

Why?

I think much of what we "inherit" are belief systems, which we sometimes don't question enough. True for me... may not be true for you.

sooz

[indian_blues]

is this a hindu belief?
so are u saying that hindus believe that the outcome of a child's life is dependent upon the previous actions of the the parents (which therefore influence parents' karma)

yes right.

[mike435]

ok, but what about someone who is born with an incurable disease?

difficult question...

today i was at the memorial of a firends sister she was only 14 died of sickness

the question on my mined and i am sure manys mined was
were is the justice in that? why would an all just all loving g-d do something like this?

perty much this is what the rabbi(jewish sepharadic orthodox)
was saying that it wanst her past or future life
he was saying that according to jewish philosophy everyone has a soul and that soul is ont its journy to g-d
and that she probably did have a good life in the past and that she was here on a mission and for her it was complete

anyways poit is it is not a game of revenge and counter revenge
i dono what i am saying i am just really ****ing pissed
we live in some ****ed up world when an innocent beautiful girl dies at natures hand

[sooz]

according to jewish philosophy everyone has a soul and that soul is ont its journy to g-d
and that she probably did have a good life in the past and that she was here on a mission and for her it was complete

I discovered this very thing in Jewish philosophy many years ago, and after talking to my Rabbi after my father died 16 years ago, I was amazed at how similar it is to some Eastern philosophies and New Age philosophies that I was involved in at the time.

The talk with that Rabbi impressed me so much, that it prompted me to study more about it. We (Jewish people) also believe in reincarnation, which many of us who are educated in Judaism in Sunday Schools, do not know. It's all very much part of Hassidic Jewish/Spiritual philosophy.

I living life, we have choice and we have divine providence (Hebrew: hashgakhah pratis). Then we have our soul's purpose here - can be karma related, can be soul-purpose related - all of this with some things free will and the bigger life-purpose divinely directed, supposedly.

Simple Karma:
Jewish Torah (Bible - Old Testament) (and I beleive similar principles in Sharia Law - someone correct me if I'm wrong, please):
An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth. Moses, Exodus 21:24

Also, someone mentioned that Karma goes through generations. Here's the original:

You shall not bow down to [idols] or worship them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the fathers to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me. Moses, Exodus 20:5

(Disclaimer: Writing about this doesn't mean I believe or don't believe in it.)

Sooz

[mike435]

I discovered this very thing in Jewish philosophy many years ago, and after talking to my Rabbi after my father died 16 years ago, I was amazed at how similar it is to some Eastern philosophies and New Age philosophies that I was involved in at the time.

The talk with that Rabbi impressed me so much, that it prompted me to study more about it. We (Jewish people) also believe in reincarnation, which many of us who are educated in Judaism in Sunday Schools, do not know. It's all very much part of Hassidic Jewish/Spiritual philosophy.

I living life, we have choice and we have divine providence (Hebrew: hashgakhah pratis). Then we have our soul's purpose here - can be karma related, can be soul-purpose related - all of this with some things free will and the bigger life-purpose divinely directed, supposedly.

Simple Karma:
Jewish Torah (Bible - Old Testament) (and I beleive similar principles in Sharia Law - someone correct me if I'm wrong, please):
An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth. Moses, Exodus 21:24

Also, someone mentioned that Karma goes through generations. Here's the original:

You shall not bow down to [idols] or worship them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the fathers to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me. Moses, Exodus 20:5

(Disclaimer: Writing about this doesn't mean I believe or don't believe in it.)

Sooz

wow you are very knowlegble
yea but it was when i satrted looking into Judaism's and noticed how it incorporates many things that other relligions focuse on, considering it came before all the religions except
arastrious from iran.

[sooz]

wow you are very knowlegble

Heheh, (in my very baby Persian...) moteshakeram doost azizam, but I'm just good at doing research on the Internet about things I *think* I know.

It's been an interest for many years to look into all sorts of religions and philosophies, much of which I find interesting but not much of which I believe.

Even though I'd be considered an agnostic, I'm still most comfortable in the Jewish/Hassidic Spiritual traditions, but not the religious dogma. It's as close as I can get to some of the New Age stuff I've been involved in over the years.

Interestingly I also became a Sanyassin (Osho) but I'm also not much of a fan these days. There are as many Sanyassins in my area as there are Jewish people (including about 800 Israelis). And to rival them, there are the Jewbus (Jews by birth but practicing Buddhists). A great book is "The Jew in the Lotus", the true story of when several prominent American Jews had an audience with the Dali Lama. Check out Jubus on Wikkipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jubu

Anyway, I'm sure this is getting right off-topic. Sorry!

To get even more off-topic, if you are in any way interested in some of the more modern interpretations of Judaism, have a look into Jewish Renewal: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_Renewal

Started by an ex-Lubavitcher, who was also influenced by Sufi traditions and Buddhism, it's evolved into something rather interesting, with meditation, Hassidic traditions, lots of music and so on, in a not so orthodox, egalitarian framework. They talk much about tikkun olam - healing the world, which is central to the Kabbalistic traditions of Judiasm. But that's a whole other discussion, I think.

Sooz

[maryam9]

today i was at the memorial of a firends sister she was only 14 died of sickness

the question on my mined and i am sure manys mined was
were is the justice in that? why would an all just all loving g-d do something like this?

perty much this is what the rabbi(jewish sepharadic orthodox)
was saying that it wanst her past or future life
he was saying that according to jewish philosophy everyone has a soul and that soul is ont its journy to g-d
and that she probably did have a good life in the past and that she was here on a mission and for her it was complete

anyways poit is it is not a game of revenge and counter revenge
i dono what i am saying i am just really ****ing pissed
we live in some ****ed up world when an innocent beautiful girl dies at natures hand

that is also a bahai belief.

that the purpose of our life on this earth is to prepare ourselves for the next world. and one way to prepare yourself is to pray. prayer is like food for the soul.

[mike435]

that is also a bahai belief.

that the purpose of our life on this earth is to prepare ourselves for the next world. and one way to prepare yourself is to pray. prayer is like food for the soul.

thats awsom same here regardig praying
it is especialy true about saying a blessing over food
say when you eat the apple the physical apple nurishes your physical body and the blessing over the apple nourishes your soul

and the list continues for everything
from eating to going to bathroom to having sex to buying something new

by the way thanks to all who are contributing to this thread this has been very good for me

[maryam9]

mike, what are you originally? i remember before you said you were interested in judaism, because u said you "found yourself", so that means you were something else before. are you a christian iranian? i know a few people who are middle eastern and are christian (if u dont want to reply publicly then u can PM me).