Religion and Spirituality in the 21st Century

[Dokhtar Bandari]

i guess i seldom experience it but it is mostly reding about it
my experiences were in yom kippur when i had this weird feeling
another was when i wen to jerusalem at the western wall and all of a sudden just started tearing up this was especially significant because at the time i only saw the wall at a source of Jewish identity and nothing g-dly infact i dont think i even believed in g-d at the time
also sometimes when i just fill satisfied when i am in a religious community i just feel complete and happy and not just happy as in a a smile but a unique feeling of love for everything its where can really explain it but i know for sure that there is something there enough to keep me around and persuade it more through the jewish religion

I believe that is called bliss and its a feeling sort of like being high, however temporary that may be, it feels great. Now if you could keep that feeling you will be an enlighted being.

OK, you were brought up in Jewish Faith, right? So, you should know the Scripture very well, or at least well enough. We will get back to that another time, for if you do not know the scripture, it would not be a fair conversation here between you and I.

Any hooo, so would you say that spirituality is intangible and Religion a tangible condition? What do I mean by that? Intangible is something you can not see or touch, right? and tangible is opposite, you can read, see, touch it, right??? Now when you were at the wall, what felt more real to you? the way you were experiencing the bliss or what you read about the wall? So, now do you get my point. Its the intangible, the unseen which is real.

[mike435]

I believe that is called bliss and its a feeling sort of like being high, however temporary that may be, it feels great. Now if you could keep that feeling you will be an enlighted being.

OK, you were brought up in Jewish Faith, right? So, you should know the Scripture very well, or at least well enough. We will get back to that another time, for if you do not know the scripture, it would not be a fair conversation here between you and I.

Any hooo, so would you say that spirituality is intangible and Religion a tangible condition? What do I mean by that? Intangible is something you can not see or touch, right? and tangible is opposite, you can read, see, touch it, right??? Now when you were at the wall, what felt more real to you? the way you were experiencing the bliss or what you read about the wall? So, now do you get my point. Its the intangible, the unseen which is real.

intesting enough i never spoke about the feeling of the wall
as a jew you know about the wall at every relligous event and not neceirly the wall but jeruslam were the tempels were built

but religion as i said again is the celebration that is done with the sences tthat later on translates into that feeling
which we cal spirituality
touching the stone felt like touching anyother stone but the feeling it trigerred in me was some thing totaly real that wa untochoubale so you are right relligion is tangible and spirtuality intangible
one exception might be the hindu and other relligions that just totaly meditate but even than it is the stimulation of somthing physical

and regarding the scripture i dont think i now much

what about you were do you stand do achive spirituality thorugh an orginized relligion or just on your own? and if what relligion, and if alone how do you get spirituality

[Dokhtar Bandari]

For me Religion and Spirituality are 2 different if not opposite subjects. Though I fully respect your opinion as well.

In my humble opinion Religion was created by certain group of people with self interest to control the masses. In order to be powerful they had to come up with a set of moral values, valid or not, so it would be easier to control everyone. If everyone dress the same, sing the same hymns, prays to the same thing then it would be much easier to control them, basically they will march to the same drumer from here to eternity. Without really going anywhere.

Almost all of today's religion have stem from Paganism, you have the same Mother and Son figure in Christianity as you do in Ancient Egyptian religions. So, Religion to me is a redundant useless thing, good enough to breed slaves and that is all. God has nothing to do with religion.

Now Spirituality has a different meaning for me. To be spiritual one must know spirit. Who's spirit you may ask? oneself and that of the source, which ultimately is one and the same. To engage life in spiritual way, means to understand the physical reality and go beyond that which you see with your eyes and discover the unseen, which is the true reality. Example: Love, you don't see love, you don't smell love, you can't touch it or color it...so love is an unseen (intangible) property. What we know as love, is what we have created to the level of our acceptance of that love. Because Love is an energy which occupies a space in time and it can fluctuate, come and go, depending on your focus point. Example: You say to me "I love you", then we have fight, big fight, we insult each other, we go our separate ways, you see your friend and say "I hate that bitch"...right? So where did the love go? it was an energy which came to an end the moment you took your focus off of it. So in the world of spirit, that love never goes anywhere, it always just is, until you make it happen here, in physical world and then decide you want to let it go, then it goes back to where it came from, the source. To be spiritual is to believe in the unknown.

Therefore, I say that we have been lied to, the God that we have been told is our creator is not really the God that lives in the spirit of the unknown. But one close look in the mirror and you ought to recognize who God truly is.

So at the expense of offending some people (and I apologize in advance for that) I say at the physical level we are Man and the spiritual level we are God. Now if live as a spiritual person, then what are we????? You tell me.

[maryam9]

In my humble opinion Religion was created by certain group of people with self interest to control the masses. In order to be powerful they had to come up with a set of moral values, valid or not, so it would be easier to control everyone. If everyone dress the same, sing the same hymns, prays to the same thing then it would be much easier to control them, basically they will march to the same drumer from here to eternity. Without really going anywhere.

So you dont think God created religions?

[Dokhtar Bandari]

So you dont think God created religions?

OK this goes back to depends whom do you think God is? But the short of it is that Man created religion...God created Man and said "make of me what so ever you wish"...so Man being a man (lol) saw the power and its potentials and immediately went to work and created religion to make sure no one else knows about their power. Religion drives you so far away from who God is that even if you encounter God in your daily journey you will not recognize him/her.

[maryam9]

OK this goes back to depends whom do you think God is? But the short of it is that Man created religion...God created Man and said "make of me what so ever you wish"...so Man being a man (lol) saw the power and its potentials and immediately went to work and created religion to make sure no one else knows about their power. Religion drives you so far away from who God is that even if you encounter God in your daily journey you will not recognize him/her.

You're talking about idle worship (i.e. someone who worships just for the sake of it).
This is why in the Bahai faith, that it is a rule that
A - there are no clergy - because in this day and age we can read and write ourselves so we dont need someone to stand at the front and read from a book
(and which also interrelates to: B- the law of having to read holy writings youself every morning and evening (i.e. so that its you teaching yourself, not anyone standing and preaching at you).

Everyone's entitled to their own opinion I strongly disagree and do not think that religion drives you away from God (it only occurs when people overstep lines of moderation).

[maryam9]

OK this goes back to depends whom do you think God is? But the short of it is that Man created religion...God created Man and said "make of me what so ever you wish"...so Man being a man (lol) saw the power and its potentials and immediately went to work and created religion to make sure no one else knows about their power. Religion drives you so far away from who God is that even if you encounter God in your daily journey you will not recognize him/her.

well God himself cant come down can he, lol
but yes its true that man is the one who delivered the message

[maryam9]

sprituality: the funny feeling you get simmilare to love

religion: rules that eable or help you maintain that feeling

that is even though recomanded religion is not a nececity

nice defo for religion.
not too sure about the spirituality one though lol.
id rather say that spirituality is listening to your conscience and doing what is right... so i guess its very similar to being virtuous

thats my take on things anyway

[Dokhtar Bandari]

You're talking about idle worship (i.e. someone who worships just for the sake of it).
This is why in the Bahai faith, that it is a rule that
A - there are no clergy - because in this day and age we can read and write ourselves so we dont need someone to stand at the front and read from a book
(and which also interrelates to: B- the law of having to read holy writings youself every morning and evening (i.e. so that its you teaching yourself, not anyone standing and preaching at you).

Everyone's entitled to their own opinion I strongly disagree and do not think that religion drives you away from God (it only occurs when people overstep lines of moderation).

Please correct me if I am wrong, but i thought that Bahai is a faith and not a religion. Am I wrong?

One question though, why do we need religion? In your opinion with all due respect.

[maryam9]

Please correct me if I am wrong, but i thought that Bahai is a faith and not a religion. Am I wrong?

The Bahai faith is an independent religion, (& not an offshoot off Islam).

One question though, why do we need religion? In your opinion with all due respect.

By now i think youve picked up on the fact that im a theist
My response as to why we need religion: to guide us.